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Anabolics discussion on Blood Tests..., within the Bodybuilding Forum; I know this isnt the section to post, but it seems that blood tests are often posted in the AAS ...


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Old 06-13-2007, 01:01 PM   #1
slayer of souls
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Default Blood Tests...

I know this isnt the section to post, but it seems that blood tests are often posted in the AAS sections.

I do yearly blood tests and my creatinine levels were pretty elevated. I am to donate a 24 hour urine sample.

My levels last year were aalso high and my previous doctor thought it was due to my diet and training...

Any input?

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Old 06-13-2007, 05:03 PM   #2
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I think he's right. But that doesn't mean anything's broken.

From John Berardi:
What about the increased creatinine and BUN indicated by the blood test?

For starters, how about a quick discussion of the two markers?

Creatinine is commonly known as a waste product of muscle or protein metabolism. To this end, its level is a reflection of the body's muscle mass or the amount of protein in the diet. Low levels are sometimes seen in kidney damage, protein starvation, liver disease, or pregnancy.

Creatinine
Creatinine is a breakdown product of creatine phosphate in muscle, and is usually produced at a fairly constant rate by the body (depending on muscle mass).
It is mainly filtered by the kidney, though a small amount is actively secreted. Creatinine is not reabsorbed. If the filtering of the kidney is deficient, blood levels rise. This effect is used as an indicator of renal function.

However, in cases of severe renal dysfunction, the creatinine clearance rate will be overestimated because the active secretion of creatinine will account for a larger fraction of the total creatinine cleared. Men tend to have higher levels of creatinine because they have more skeletal muscle than women.

Elevated levels are sometimes seen in kidney disease due to the fact that a damaged kidney will not remove creatinine from the body as it should. Also, elevated levels are seen with the use of some drugs that could impair kidney filtration. Finally, elevated levels could also be seen with muscle degeneration, a high protein diet, or creatine supplementation.

With respect to creatinine measurements, it's important to note that the amount of creatinine in the blood is regulated by the amount being produced (from protein degradation - muscle or dietary) vs. the amount that's being removed (by the kidney).

Therefore, although creatinine in the blood could be a marker of a damaged kidney's inability to filter creatinine out of the body at a normal rate, it could also be a marker of rapid protein degradation (via muscle damage from weight training or from a high protein intake).

Think of the blood as a sink. If you turn on the faucet at a low rate, the amount of water going into the sink and the amount leaving the sink should balance each other out, leading to a predictable amount of water in the sink at any moment. However, if you partially plug the drain, you'll get more water accumulating in the sink at the same faucet flow rate.

This is similar to kidney dysfunction (thinking of the water as creatinine). However, alternatively, if the drain remains unplugged but you crank up the faucet flow rate, you'll get more water in the sink due to the higher flow. This is similar to a high protein diet.

Since weightlifters are continually breaking down muscle protein (this is a good thing), even in the absence of a high protein diet, blood creatinine concentrations tend to be elevated. Furthermore, add in a higher protein diet and creatinine concentrations in the blood will rise.

Finally, since creatinine is also a breakdown product of creatine, if a weightlifter is taking creatine supplements (which most do), blood creatinine concentrations will also be high. What all of this means is that the faucet is turned up in weightlifters, not that the drain is plugged.

To address the other relevant measure, the nitrogen component of urea, blood urea nitrogen (BUN), is the end product of protein metabolism and its concentration is also influenced by the rate of excretion (as is creatinine). Excessive protein intake, kidney damage, certain drugs, low fluid intake, intestinal bleeding, exercise, or heart failure can cause increases in BUN.

BUN Testing
The blood urea nitrogen (BUN) test is a measure of the amount of nitrogen in the blood that comes from urea. Urea is a substance secreted by the liver, and removed from the blood by the kidneys.
The most common cause of an elevated BUN, azotemia, is due to renal failure. This can be due to a temporary condition such as dehydration or shock.

Decreased levels may be due to a poor diet, malabsorption, liver damage, or low nitrogen intake. Excess BUN is even more closely correlated with protein intake than is creatinine. The same argument above applies here.

So, as you can see, since both creatinine and BUN are correlated with both high protein metabolism AND kidney function, I'm not suggesting that it's unreasonable that doctors are worried about the kidneys of your son or daughter.

But it's important for you and your doctor to realize that the increases in BUN and creatinine seen in healthy weightlifters who eat higher protein diets aren't necessarily a function of kidney health but are much more closely correlated with their diet and training.

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If you act sanctimonious I will just list out your logical fallacies until you get pissed off and spew blasphemous remarks.
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Old 06-19-2007, 04:28 PM   #3
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Thanks for the article Eric, it was very helpful. I agree chances are that it is simply due to my diet, training and supplementation. I did a 24hour urine test and will get my results soon.

Thanks again.
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Old 06-25-2007, 01:59 PM   #4
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Tests came back today and apparently I can heal myself. All values were normal even creatinine!
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