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FlyUSMC 03-28-2007 10:21 AM

Diet composition question
 
A typical cutting diet is 50/35/15. A bulking (and maintenance?) diet is 40/20/40. However, I've also always heard that the ultimatum for weight loss is calories in<calories out. Question is, how much harder is it to lose weight with bulking ratios, and why? Just a random question, I like to know stuff...

Kane 03-28-2007 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyUSMC (Post 32454)
how much harder is it to lose weight with bulking ratios, and why?

Alot harder because your goal is to gain weight when bulking. Therefore calories in is much greater than calories out (hence weight gain). Carbs and fat are also higher proportions for bulking and those are what you would limit during a cut.

If you're losing weight while 'bulking' then technically you're 'bulk' diet would be a cutting diet, would it not? (Rhetorical :D)

Dropping fat while bulking is difficult (which is what I think you meant to ask) but can be done. IMO dropping fat while trying to gain muscle is not efficient. Essentially you could have a bulking cycle followed by a cut cycle and be further ahead in terms of lean mass as opposed to trying to do a clean bulk.

To sum it all up: A bulking ratio is used for bulking, if you're dropping weight then you fucked up your diet

ps. Those ratios are not set in stone, they're merely guidelines to help set up your diet.

FlyUSMC 03-28-2007 03:54 PM

I see where you could have found that... my bad :biglaugh:
What I meant to ask was this:
If you are eating 500 under maintenance (say 1500cal) but with the bulking ratio (so those 1500 calories were 40% protein, 40% carb, 20% fat), how much harder would it be to lose fat, and why? Would you have more potential for gaining muscle under those conditions as well? Well, I don't know if gaining is the right word anyway, as you're not eating enough. But logically it would make sense that if you give your body muscle food and deprive it of fat food, it will build the muscles up and take the fat down while maintaining weight.

Kane 03-28-2007 04:07 PM

Its still harder because you have more fat and more carbs in a bulking ratio than in a typical cutting ratio.

Take those same 1500 calories. For a cutting scheme 35% is carbs, 15% is fat and 50% is protein.

Here's my questions to you (you don't need to answer, just think about the answers):

-Would it be easier to lose fat when you're intake is 15% fat or when its 20% fat?

-Would you gain more muscle with 40% of your intake being protein or with 50% being protein?

FlyUSMC 03-28-2007 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kane (Post 32496)
For a cutting scheme 35% is carbs, 15% is fat and 50% is protein.

Here's my questions to you (you don't need to answer, just think about the answers):

-Would it be easier to lose fat when you're intake is 15% fat or when its 20% fat?

-Would you gain more muscle with 40% of your intake being protein or with 50% being protein?

Isn't the ratio 35% fats and 15% carbs?

Kane 03-28-2007 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyUSMC (Post 32504)
Isn't the ratio 35% fats and 15% carbs?

Fuck. Yeah it is. I got mixed up :wtf:

In any event, your carbs are still high with the bulk ratio...Here are the numbers I came up with for bulk and cut using 1500cals and a sedentary lifestyle.

Cutting (Grams) Pro Fat Carbs
Sedentary 188 58 56


Bulking (Grams) Pro Fat Carbs
Sedentary 150 33 150

You can see the main difference maker is the carbs. Just because the calories add up to 1500 doesnt mean the grams have to be equal for cut/bulk btw. Also 1g of fat is 9 cals, 1g pro/carb is 4 cals.

hrdgain81 03-29-2007 06:10 AM

the main thing is, the body reacts very differently to each marco nutrient. Your goal while cutting is to mobilize fat stores for use as fuel for the body. If you have a ratio to high in carbs your body wont have need to utilize fat stores for energy. Now this is a general statement on how the body works, not a difinitive answer.

I only say this because some people (not my fat ass) can take in hundreds of grams of carbs a day, and still shed bodyfat. The majority of us can not. Just understand that your macro breakdown is not the do all end all of diet specifications.

ChinPieceDave667 03-29-2007 06:29 AM

to tell you the true I've lost wieght on a 40/40/20 with very little problem. It depends on the persons body type and how they react to carbs.

TALO 03-29-2007 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChinPieceDave667 (Post 32538)
to tell you the true I've lost wieght on a 40/40/20 with very little problem. It depends on the persons body type and how they react to carbs.

Same here. And it depends on what kind of food your taking in aswell. Meaning chicken and fish is alot different than hamburger and steak. Same with rice and potatoes compared to bread and pasta.


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