ephedra stack?

[RutgersKid]

i am using a ephedra stack of 25 mg ephedra, 300mg of caffiene twice daily. Has anyone used this type of stack...it seems like its not really effective i don;t feel anything..http://www.allsupplementinfo.com/Spo...s/Ephedra.html said the stack should have aspirin in it...any one got any ideas...i am dieting and dont have energy since i eat only 1800 cals...i weigh now 180lbs..my weight been coming off(was 199 3 months ago) but my energy levels are really low..it would try the whole stack but aspirin seems a little scary..has one tried it or heard of someone else trying it?
thanks

[verbatimreturned]

An ECA stack is a very popular choice and adding in Aspirin wouldnt be a bad idea at all heres a part of an article on "ECA" at wikipedia which explains what these 3 supplements do, and why Aspirin is a good idea to add

The effects of the ECA stack in weight loss are primarily due to the ephedrine component. Ephedrine acts both as a beta agonist and stimulates the release of noradrenaline. Increased circulating noradrenaline in the body then acts on white adipose tissue by increasing cAMP levels. This causes a thermogenic effect, raising body temperature by about 2 degrees and increasing the user's metabolism by 10% in conjunction with the rest of the stack.

However, the body's negative feedback system then activates to normalize the metabolism. This is done via the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cells, and prostaglandins outside the cell, which both lower cAMP levels within the cell.

Caffeine inhibits the production of phosphodiesterase inside the cell and therefore slows the cAMP breakdown. It also, by binding with and competitively inhibiting adenosine receptors in the brain, triggers the release of adrenaline which increases cAMP levels further.

Aspirin inhibits prostaglandin production outside of the cells, which, in conjunction with caffeine, greatly prolongs the thermogenic effects and increased metabolism by substaining elevated cAMP levels.

More details on this type of stack can be found http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECA_stack which covers dosages, etc.

[Darkhorse]

Here's a quote from Layne saying to NOT take aspirin PREworkout.

Originally Posted by Layne

I see that alot of you are currently taking ECA stacks before your workouts. May I suggest that you ditch anything containing aspirin (when taken pre workout) let me explain.

When you workout your body sends signals (i.e. releases hormones) which "tell" your cells that damage has occurred. Many of these hormones work by attatching to a receptor and then starting a signal cascade which activates "local messengers" and "secondary" hormones (i.e. prostoglandins and cAMP).
One group of local messengers are called prostoglandins. Prostoglandins are inflamitory hormones which signal the cell that the tissue has been damaged and to begin synthesizing protein. In the case of muscle tissue... lifting causes and inflammatory response to the tissue damage done by lifting. This causes prostoglandins to be synthesized and these prostoglandins continue the messege cascade, "relaying" the message to the nucleus to start DNA transcription, and thus protein synthesis. This is a good thing... it is one of the things that makes us grow.

Now a little about how prostoglandins are synthesized. They are synthesized from an essential fatty acid called Arachnidonic acid. It is called essential because your body cannot produce it from scratch. Most of the arachnidonic acid is made by converting your dietary intake of Linoleic acid to Arachnidonic acid. Most of this arachnidonic acid is stored your cells phospholipid bilayer. When you workout induced hormone (I don't know the specific hormone) attatches to the cell surface receptor, it causes phospholipase 2 to become active. This enzyme then liberates Arachnidonic acid from the phospholipid bilayer. Cyclooxygenase enzymes (COX1 and COX2) then catalyze the conversion of Arachnidonic acid to the eicosinoids PGG2 (via COX1) and this is then converted to PGH2 via COX2.

Aspirin is a covalent inhibitor of these enzymes. This means it actually attatches to the active site via an actual bond. Once it is attatched the enzyme is said to be "inhibited" and can no longer catalyze the reaction. Thus, prostoglandins cannot be synthesized, and the messege will not be sent to the Nucleus to begin protein synthesis. This has been confirmed in several experiments that show COX inhibitor administration (this includes aspirin, acetominophin, and ibuprofin) knock the exercise induced 76% rise in protein synthesis back down to baseline levels.

Thus my suggestion is to not take ECA within 5 hours of your workout. If you feel you must take a stimulant pre-workout, make sure it does not contain aspirin or any derivitave (white willow bark, et. al)

So lets recap...
Hormone signal -> phospholipase 2 active-> release of AA from membrane-> COX conversion of AA to prostoglandins(this is where aspirin stops the pathway) ->signal for protein synthesis-> protein synthesis

Peace

[hrdgain81]

I would not add asprin for the simple fact that the more you use it, the less effective it will be for pain reduction if you need it. This in addition to what 0311 posted.

How long have you been taking the e/c stack? and are you a regular caffiene user? 300mg seems very high to me, you could be used to it already.

You also need to remember that e/c should be cycled. Your beta2 receptors will downregulate after 2 or 3 weeks. I would cycle two wks on two wks off.

oh and just as an aside, just cause you dont "feel" it, doesnt mean its not working.

[BG5150]

If you want more energy, why don't you just eat more?

[s2kinteg916]

Whats your diet like ? and also when do u take ur eca stack ? I notice a huge difference since i been taking it such as major sweating and i get a bit hyper and jittery. I also been eating alot of meals so my metabolism at night tends to go haywire.....

[tesla]

that should be used like this 50mg ef. 200mg coff. 300mg asp. after 5-6 days of use a half of these dossages to reach your body tollerance.use it only one hour before cardio workout and should be no peroblems,and i recommending cardio after weight training.food intake you should gues by yourself...(calories until weight training,after cardio less calories...) and that must work no metter what but be careful about how many days you about to use it...