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Nutrition discussion on Food combinations, within the Bodybuilding Forum; I have recently made a big push towards better health. I have had a good-ish diet for some time and ...


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Old 11-13-2005, 12:03 PM   #1
TheRealDC
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Default Food combinations

I have recently made a big push towards better health. I have had a good-ish diet for some time and have also detoxed last month. At the spa I detoxed at they gave out info about food combinations, now it may not agree with what alot of your diet's on this forum. I was wondering if any of you follow this kind of diet or have heard of it? Could it be compatable with many diet's on here?
Tha main principles are based on maintaining health, some of the things they say to follow are: do not mix: protein with starch, protein with Fruit, Veg and fruit, veg and starch, veg and fruits. This is just a basic list I have written. The principles behind this are the way the body digest things, it uses different natural chemicals for protein and starches, to mention one. I have been on this for about 4 weeks and feel great, quit smoking everything, and almost don't drink alcohol at all. My mind is clear and energy levels are through the roof compared to before. I am looking to bulk up as well as improve my health, I am not looking for a huge size but want to improve, so, what do you guys think? Does this sort of diet have any place in the weight lifting world?
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Old 11-13-2005, 01:00 PM   #2
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Congrats on moving towards a healthier lifestyle. I'll be honest, I have never heard of avoiding food combinations such as protein with fruit, veg and fruit, etc so to me that seems a little out there.

If you want to put on some muscle you are going to need to increase your protein intake. The best suggestion is to eat some protein with every meal. So that means have food combinations such as protein + carbs (minimal fat) and protein + fats (healthy fats).

The main thing you want to avoid is combing carbs and fats in the same meal or having just a high carb meal. Both of these meals will tend to lead to an insulin spike and increase fat storage.
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Old 11-13-2005, 02:09 PM   #3
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I've heard of this. The crux of it is the basic supposition that the human body was created "broken" and that without and without constant attention to just the right combination of foods, overindulgence, poor nutrient assimilation, gas, blood disease, liver problems, kidney problems, bacterial toxins in the gut (the list goes on and on) will occur.

So, as you mentioned, different types of foods need different enzymes to digest them. But it is believed that if you combine too many different foods at once, the body will become "confused" and will be unable to make all the necessary enzymes at one time. Then, bacterial fermentation will result and blah, blah, blah.

Okay, well, I actually do think there is a kernel of truth in it. The amount of food you eat, and the combination you eat them in, does affect digestion. The problem is that some of this "new age" dietary advice takes a simple idea and expands on it past the point of all reason.

For one, a healthy body is very efficient at digesting a great variety of foods. For another, it gives one small aspect of healthy nutrition a life all it's own, and ignores scads of other criteria such as some of the things Sleazy mentioned, like insulin response, which is not just important to bodybuilders.

The main thing, though, is that it's not based on any real science, but on mistaken assumptions. You take someone who has been leading an unhealthy lifesyle for long enough - overeating, eating overprocessed foods, gorging on snack crap, drinking heavily, basing most of their diet on one thing, like eating most all meat, whatever, and you switch them to a diet of healthier foods in general, at a proper intake, and after a while they're going to feel better, no matter how you combine the food. And it could be any number of things that is causing that, and probably is.

Of course I don't know all the ins and outs of what was reccommended to you, but some of these diets are so complicated and unmanageable - I mean, you're going to be all the time worrying about every little scrap of food you put in your mouth, if it's the proper timing, the proper combination, you are lible to get sick just from the stress.

The idea that the body can't produce the enzymes it needs, well, that, in a nutshell, is just hogwash. But that doesn't mean that everything they say is untrue. I certainly agree with the idea that all the food you eat should be as nutrient dense as possible.

I don't think any of it is very compatible with bodybuilding. I agree with the basic dietary guidelines that Sleazy has given you. You definitely need more protein. Think about lean protein sources, complex carbs like whole grains, green vegetables, healthy fats (especially your EFA's).

People here can give you more specific advice once they no your specific goals.
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Old 11-13-2005, 02:44 PM   #4
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Hey fantastic guys!!! Thanks for your input Alot to think about. I know diet is very ipmortant!!! It is a matter of learning for me now, my diet is very healthy and I have not had much problems with the combinations, only a few small adjustments, but I know there is so much to learn. I know my protein input needs increasing. I eat alot of fish, chicken, but eat very little red meat, my digestive system is still not great, years of abuse will take time to get back on track, but am working on it. For the moment I am eating alot of raw fresh veg and fruit, cut coffee out and drink alot of water, maybe 3+ litres filtered per day,and jasmine/green tea with unrefined sugar or honey. I have lost alot of weight in the last year without losing my size and now I am getting bigger while my fat seems to be getting less. Which makes me happy. I do know this could be cause I am finally going to the gym and may soon topout!!! So I will be reading through many post's on here and learning as fast as possible!!! I am amazed at the knowledge you guys have, very impressive.
What are some other natural protein's that I could eat???
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Old 11-13-2005, 03:11 PM   #5
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Very nice post Eric, you have more patience than I do for writing that long of a response

Quote:
What are some other natural protein's that I could eat???
This sample grocery list is a good place to start and then you can expand into the specific categories that these foods are in (such as shrimp is shellfish etc)

http://www.bodybuilding.net/nutritio...t=grocery+list
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Old 11-15-2005, 12:23 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy
Very nice post Eric, you have more patience than I do for writing that long of a response
I appreciate that, Sleazy.

I guess I do tend to run off at the keyboard.
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Old 03-28-2006, 10:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy
The main thing you want to avoid is combing carbs and fats in the same meal or having just a high carb meal. Both of these meals will tend to lead to an insulin spike and increase fat storage.
This suggestion has been of real interest to me lately.

Research has indicated that when fat added to a carb meals impairs gastric emptying and impairs enzyme carbohydrate interaction. It results in a rise of blood glucose concentration when fats and carbohydrates are combined, this should be avoided if you intend to minimize insulin levels.

However, nutrient storage/utilization is not instantaneous thus immediately after consumption fats and carbohydrates donít appear in your bloodstream. Furthermore fat goes though a different pathway to reach the bloodstream then protein and carbohydrates. Hence combining C+P+F, is acceptable


Could anyone shed some light on this issue or perhaps some recent studies which confirm either one of these claims?

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Old 03-29-2006, 09:13 AM   #8
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The latter argument is false.

If someone is hypoglycemic, a bit of sugar can bring them out of it almost instantly. Whey on an empty stomach will drain almost directly into the duodenum & start absorbing right away.

As for different pathways, fat droplets, free & peptide bonded aminos, sugars & water all soak through the gut lining into blood vessels that pretty much all go to the liver, so no - the physical routes are the same. Different enzymes work on different nutrients in the gut, and different metabolic pathways are used to make use of the nutrients once they are in the body, but they don't go via distinct pathways into the blood.

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Old 03-29-2006, 09:25 AM   #9
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HMMM....

[Effect of dietary fat on blood sugar levels and insulin consumption after intake of various carbohydrate carriers in type I diabetics on the artificial pancreas]

Wakhloo AK, Beyer J, Diederich C, Schulz G.

The role of fat on carbohydrate absorption was investigated in 14 type-I-diabetics who were connected to a glucose-monitored insulin infusion pump (Biostator, Miles). The patients received test meals in the form of potatoes, rice and apples with equal carbohydrate content, in each case with and without added fat. Comparison of carbohydrate carriers showed an increase of blood sugar and insulin consumption which was biggest after the potato meal and significantly lower after rice and apple ingestion. This is probably related to the different biologic availability of carbohydrate carriers. Addition of fat caused lowering of blood sugar and insulin consumption in the potato meal; in this case nutritional fat is likely to have slowed gastrointestinal passage. There were no major differences among rice and apple. It can be concluded that addition of fat delays absorption of rapidly split carbohydrates more than absorption of slowly split carbohydrates such as rice. The lack of influence of fat on postprandial blood sugar and insulin consumption after an apple meal is related to the slight increase of blood sugar caused by the high content of fructose.

__________________________________________________ _____________

Don't know if this helps.

So much of this type of research is done on diabetes......
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Old 03-29-2006, 09:54 AM   #10
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^^^ good study...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy
Eric, you have more patience than I do for writing that long of a response
ha ha...!
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