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In-Season Lifting
Hey guys. I finally decided to start one of these. I posted recently about how to train in season (I'm a college wrestler) and had two very different suggestions, both very enlightening:
- Kane suggested a 3-day split with a day devoted each to pressing, squatting, and deadlifts, with assistance movements on each day and hip mobility work on the DL day. - Anuj suggested a routine with more unilateral work to develop power for wrestling, and to wave the volume to avoid overtraining during season. I liked Anuj's idea, and was planning on experimenting with it during season, but I had reevaluate my goals a bit, realizing that I'm going 197 and I've got probably the muscle mass of a 184 pounder. I want to develop power, but I need to develop mass, and now I've got more or less carte blanche to eat whatever I want, so I figured I'd take advantage of the opportunity. With that in mind I decided to try Kane's split - it's a little more customizable, takes less time, and might be better for developing mass. So this is what I came up with. I decided to keep the hip mobility work a little lighter, partially because I'm still not sure where my back and PC are post-injury, and partially to keep my lifting from interfering too heavily with my wrestling. I'd appreciate any suggestions - Kane, this is your thing, so tell me if I did it wrong. I still might be overprogramming a little bit or a lot, so let me know: it rotates Weeks 1 and 2 as well. Sorry about the caps lock, by the way. MONDAY (PRESSING DAY) (HEAVY) WEEK 1: FLAT BENCH 5X5 MILITARY PRESS 3X8 CLOSE GRIP BENCH 2X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 WEEK 2: INCLINE BENCH 4X5 FLOOR PRESS 4X5 MILITARY PRESS 3X8 CLOSE GRIP BENCH 2X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 WEDNESDAY (HIP MOBILITY) (LIGHT) WEEK 1: ROMANIAN DEADLIFT 4X8 SPLIT SQUAT 3X8 SUITCASE DEADLIFT 2X10 LUNGES 1X12 (PER LEG) WEEK 2: CLEAN AND JERK 4X6 HANG CLEAN 3X8 PUSH PRESS 3X8 FRIDAY (SQUATTING DAY) (HEAVY) WEEK 1: BACK SQUAT 3X5 FRONT SQUAT 3X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 WEEK 2: HIGH BOX SQUAT 3X5 FRONT SQUAT 3X8 SPLIT SQUAT 3X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 I'll post Day One from today in a new post. Yours truly, A dude who no longer actually uses cradles, but did when he made this name |
check out the stretching and flexibility article...for lots of hip mobility stuff.
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Day 1 - 10/6/08
This was about two hours after practice but I had a decent amount of food in between. Bench Press: 205 x 5, 210 x 5, 210 x 5, 210 x 5, 215 x 5 Military Press: 115 x 8, 115 x 8, 115 x 8 Close Grip Bench Press: 155 x 8, 165 x 8 Weighted Situps: 45 x 10, 90 x 10, 90 x 10 Felt good - could have pushed it more on the bench press but it's coming back from a long hiatus. I was at (230 x 5) x 3 before I took about five weeks off - I shut down all lifting just to make sure my back healed up the damn right way. The other lifts all felt great - I need to work out a more efficient means of doing weighted situps (holding a plate is not going to work when I get past 90lbs.) but for now it worked out. Excited to get back into the swing of lifting - so much time off left me stir crazy. |
Pity - you post fast. And I will. Like I said - probably loads of mistakes.
I should mention that the hip mobility work is also probably better described as hip mobility and explosive movements. Whether this makes sense is beyond my jurisdiction. |
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You may want to increase the seperation between your exercises, in terms or rep ranges. Take your first exercise and do some heavy triples even, say 4 sets of 3, then treat the rest as 'hypertrophy'. Maybe do a couple or a few sets of 6-8 depending, or maybe a single set of 6-8 if you have multiple exercises. For the sake of argument I'll refer to the 'hypertrophy' exercises/sets as backoffs. WEEK 2: INCLINE BENCH 4X5 FLOOR PRESS 4X5 MILITARY PRESS 3X8 CLOSE GRIP BENCH 2X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 Week 2: Incline 2x3 Floor Press 2-3x2-3 MP isn't needed since you have lots of pressing on wed. during week 2 CG Bench 2-3x6-8 Backoff Situps WEEK 2: CLEAN AND JERK 4X6 HANG CLEAN 3X8 PUSH PRESS 3X8 Week 2: CJ 4-5x2-3 Its a power exercise, so it might be good to use it as one Hang Clean 1-2x6-8 Backoff Push Press 1-2x6-8 Backoff WEEK 2: HIGH BOX SQUAT 3X5 FRONT SQUAT 3X8 SPLIT SQUAT 3X8 WEIGHTED SITUPS 3X10 Week 2: High Box 2-3x3 Front Squat 1-2x6-8 Backoff Split Squat 1-2x6-8 Backoff Week 1 seems to be alright, it could be tweaked in the same way. But it has the volume starting high and tapering off towards the end, you may want to switch that a bit so you accumulate volume and fatigue throughout the week rather than each day. Week 2 is high volume at the start and finish and somewhat lower in the middle. I didn't take that into account when I made my changes, but it is something you may want to look at as well. |
Kane - that makes a lot of sense. I dropped the reps on the primary lift for each day - some more sharply than others, but still - and set the others a little higher. Thanks.
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No Problem :D
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Day 2 - 10/8/08
Before practice, so no diminished performance. For now I'm electing to drop the suitcase deadlifts - there's a lot of unilateral or split-legged movements on this day anyway and I wasn't sure if I wanted the volume that high. RDLs: (199 x 6) x 3 (This was with the bumper plates, which were in kilos... 199 is my rough conversion) Split Squat (135 x 8) x 3 Split squats are a movement I've never even worked with before, so today was just getting used to the form. I definitely want to work with them more, though - Anuj was right about unilateral movements for athletes. Lunges 135 x 12 (each leg) Same thing as with the split squats - I'd obviously done lunges but never worked with them in a serious routine. Looking forward to developing both of these lifts. |
suitcase deads are a core exercise...that uses both legs :) and one arm :)
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Heh. I was being kinda unclear. I just mean that there were a lot of movements that seemed to tax balance, or else tax each side differently, as I imagine Suitcase dl's would. Plus, frankly, like I said, something probably just needed to go anyway to keep this manageable with my wrestling workload.
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werd.
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glad you agree :biglaugh:
for the first time in my wrestling career, i now have a lifting coach and team lifts along with it - unfortunate, since his workouts are all hi-volume, lo-intensity supersets and if anything i'm figuring they'll just take away from my big lifts, since i don't think i want to squat heavy one day and then have - as his program dictates - 4x20 squats that night. i'm thinking about allowing, if i need to, for this scenario (tell me your thoughts) - keep the heavy pressing day on monday and the heavy squatting day on thursday, dropping the hip mobility that week. or, maybe a better answer would be: squat AND bench heavy on monday with one assistance lift for each, then hit my usual wednesday lift on wed/thurs. thoughts? |
don't ditch mobility. it takes minutes...seriously.
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then there you go. i was leaning towards putting the heavy compounds together anyway.
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You can just do your mobility work in the fom of mobility warmups before you workout. Then you can augement that, at home if need be, any time that's convenient. You should be able, once you get all the movements down, to do your warmups in about 10 minutes, all told. Unless you have some special needs and have to throw in a few extra moves.
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fair enough. in that case, if i were going to maintain that 2-day split, maybe heavy pressing/squatting as before, and power moves on the other day? what i have up there is leaning more towards power already anyway (c+j, etc.)
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LOL, can you lay out what you are talking about. My brain is tired and I'm confused :D
BTW, as far as the whole question of what single leg to do or not to do...just put one in for a little while and then switch to another if you don't want to do both. I'd honestly vote for single leg squats over static split squats for a wrestler though... |
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pretty sure they offer more balance and coordination benefits.
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they also offer more opportunities for me to fall on my ass :biglaugh:
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The reason I said that is because single leg squats are not just about balance. They are about stability at the hip and ankle. They teach proper firing, etc...
Balance and stability are not the same thing. Keep that in mind. Balance is "equilibrium". Stability is more like resistance to movement. Anybody can do static split squats and lunges, etc...well with not very much practice. And while I can sing the praises of any single leg movement all day...as I often do, haha..."mastering" the single leg squat puts you way far ahead of the game. Not that you can't work in both...you can if you want. Hell just "practicing" the single leg goes a long way. But while split squat variations require a balance component and they are "uneven" so you get that kind of core component, along with so many other benefits you are "somewhat balanced" and "somewhat stabilized" the whole time. Even with lunges your never exactly doing it on one foot since the weight is being shifted in a mechanically favorable way..i.e. a natural way. But let me just say, for perspectives sake, that it was just a casual comment as far as my druthers. Most people don't do any sinlge leg stuff at all! I can hardly argue single leg squats versus split squat variations without pointing out that just DOING single leg stuff in the first place is one thousand percent better. BUT with a static supported or dynamic supported single leg movement the glute medius and hip rotators do not really have to work to stabilize the hip and prevent internal rotation of the femur. Whereas with single legs squats, UNSUPPORTED, they do..which has obvious benefits for knee health and not just proper hip stability. It's all a chain, after all. There is a lot of need for core bracing. It take real strength to do it. etc and so on. A single leg squat will actually carry over, imo, to a static split squat and hence to a later progression to lunge variations, imo, but the reverse is not true. And I know it was just a question, btw, Crade :D. I don't take every query as a challenge! |
Day 3 - 10/11/08
I would have worked out yesterday but I was on the road coming home for Fall Break. So I worked out in my old gym - the yuppie one with only one squat rack, ha. But it was enough since there weren't many people there. I changed my design around a little as per Kane's suggestions and I like it better this way. Back Squat (365 x 2) x 6 Felt very, very good. I'm thrilled to finally be working with some legitimate weights - I think it was just a mental block that kept me from breaking through to the higher numbers before. Front Squat (135 x 8) x 2 By this point I was fairly gassed, and front squats are still fairly new to me, like a few of the other movements I'm incorporating, so I started real low. I'll look to progress here but my focus is still going to be on my back squat. Weighted Situps (110 x 10) x 3 (2 55-lb. dumbbells) All in all a good day... and coming home to two plates full of steak ain't bad either. :) |
Day 4 - 10/13/08
Not a great workout - I'm getting some tendonitis in my left shoulder, and while I was doing mostly triceps-dominated stuff today, it just distracted the hell out of me. Warmup - 25 pushups 80 x 15 rope pushdowns 15 pushups 80 x 10 rope pushdowns Warmup sets on floor press Floor Press (255 x 2) x 2 Skullcrushers 90 x 6, (110 x 6) x 2 I could probably have done more here. Close Grip Bench (pinkies on the inside of the knurling) 165 x 8 170 x 8 After I finished my normal sets I did a few more sets of pushdowns and some other tricep work just to finish out. |
I missed Wednesday's lift and I decided I need to take some time off - I hate to do it but I need to wait until my body adapts to the daily rigors of practice before I can start adding to it. I am going to try like hell to avoid overtraining, which is going to be tough given our schedule.
When I come back, though, I may make some changes in my routine. I plateau'd on bench, or have been recently, and I'm going to take DH's advice and drop bench out for a while. I'll probably replace it with some heavy tricep work. |
Day 5 - Oct 18th 2008
I keep moving this workout to Saturday. Yesterday and the day before I was cutting weight to certify at my weight class, which meant a total of 19 lbs. in those two days. So I was not up to lift. Practice this morning was easy so I decided to get some work in. I was late to the gym - it closes at 5 on Saturdays which sucks - but I got my high box work in. I'd never squatted on a box before and I wanted to see how it was. High Box Squat 335 x 2 355 x 2 365 x 2 Felt very good. I had the box slightly above parallel. I put 155 on the bar - very light - and tried some front squats but I need to work on the form. I guess I just need time to adjust but I couldn't hold on to the bar very well. Not a lot of work here but for the circumstances - coming out of weight cutting and after practice - I felt good just to mess around with the form. |
for the fronts...i like the cross grip...get under the bar so the bar is basically crushing your adams apple....then get your shoulders under the bar...so it's sitting on your front delts. right hand goes onto the bar on the left side of your neck and vice versa. then........stand up :)
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^ I tried that. I think I didn't have it high enough, from the way you're describing it. I'll have to try that - thanks!
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^^ And I hate the cross grip. I just put my hands on my deltoids and rest the bar on top of that. I have the bar in the same position as Pity though. Just keep the bar high/back & your elbows up. It seems like most people are split as far as preference for hand placement goes. The bar should be in the same place either way.
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^I tried that one too haha. I think in both cases I needed it higher up and farther back (itt: connor does not know how front squat :biglaugh:). Thanks ross!
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A question for anyone - Westside has a lot of info about box squatting and one such article says:
"A lighter weight can achieve a bigger squat with box squatting. By training at 50-60% of your 1-rep max in a 3-week wave, a large squat can be developed. Three lifters trained with 405-480 for 8-10 doubles with 120 pounds of chain as a reactive method. They all made their first 800+ squat." Why is it better to use lighter weights when box squatting? is this only applicable when using bands/chains? right now, as above, i'm doing heavy box squats - should i change that up or no? |
Are you any where near an 800 pound squat?
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EDIT: I don't know which way my post was taken, but after reading it, it's not very clear. Just to clarify, by "change it up", I mean add variety. Definitely don't replace heavy box squatting with light box squats. Light (focus is on speed) box squatting is a good supplemental lift. It may help with your progression on heavier box squats. It has helped me significantly. I'm still the slowest person on Earth though. |
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Not to shit on Ross' advice or anything, I think its a good idea to switch it up. Just not at the expense of some easy progression, well relatively easy I guess :D Basically following the advice of the quote you posted doesn't make a whole lot of sense imho. |
How many times can Westside cite 800 pound squats in articles aimed at a general audience?
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Apparently they haven't reached the limit yet :)
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Who's gonna tell them to stop doing it? They can squat over 800 lbs, thats like trying to tell a thousand pound gorilla where to sit. :biglaugh:
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ha. no i am not near 800 of course. kane - i should have thought of that first (the whole if it ain't broke logic). eric - i guess this goes back to that authority thing. everyone - thanks, i guess there's no reason not to just keep on truckin'.
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Kane gave great advice. If you're progressing, don't change anything. No point to doing speed work right now if you're still gaining on whatever you're currently doing. When reading Westside articles, you need to take most of what they say and put it on the back burner for a later time. For example, I incorperated a few months of starting off every workout w/ 4 x 15 neutral db pressing to strengthen my bench and increase my GPP. And did it? Good God, yes. But how many others wouldn't come close to recovering enough, which leads many down the Injury Express..
I like to think about it this way. What may work for many, won't necessarily mean all. I have a good friend in another forum that spent the entire summer training at Westside, and a good amount of what he says they do over there doesn't come close to reflecting what those articles say lol. As an example, he says most of them nix the speed squats altogether, and many do something like a max squat day, then a max deadlift day later in the week. Tons, I mean tons of Louie's stuff out there isn't used today.. He could just type out a brand new article, and before the ink sets, he's already changed it LMAO! But, I'm telling you right now that even the most dated stuff THEY don't do anymore has absolutely made the difference in MY training. :) Quote:
"In the book, Supertraining, authors Siff and Verkershonsky state that the best range for developing explosive strength in the barbell squat is two-thirds of your best 1RM." - Tate Of course a lot less of a percentage is used over there at Westside because of how advanced they are. "The lifters at Westside are more experienced and are recruiting more motor units. Therefore, fewer percentages are needed to produce the desired results." - Tate It's almost always done in 3 week waves since typically you don't get any stronger thereafter. The reactive method is almost always used for speed work. That could mean chains, bands, weight releasers, or a combination thereof. It's all there to develop speed (Power = Distance x Speed) or something like that lol. Heavy weight one day, submaximal weight done as fast as possible the other. For benching, doing 3 reps working on speed is the equivalant of straining with a max weight (meaning the same time it takes three fast reps = 1 rep max if you were to time it more or less). I guess if I was to use an less than accurate example that would show you want all that means: A person with a 350 bench as a 1 RM would press 200 lbs a lot faster than someone with a 300 lb bench. The formula for speed work always stays the same for everyone, no matter where you are in training because it's based off of percentages. Example: Bodybuilder A's best squat is 800 lbs. Assuming no accomodating resistance, he could start speed work with 400 lbs (50%) for 8-12 sets of doubles (45-60 seconds rest between sets). Bodybuilder B's best squat is 400 lbs. Assuming no accomodating resistance, he could start speed work with 200 lbs (50%) for 8-12 sets of doubles (45-60 seconds rest between sets). I just wanted to give some very basic insight into what that 2 liner was saying. Louie has a nasty habit in his writings of only appealing to the Elite total lifters only. But that's really not his fault, just writing style to show everyone that the conjugate method is superior. Assuming that everyone starts off somewhere, and they don't start squatting 400 lbs out of the womb, I feel he's trying to appeal to your sense of grandeur (ie. stick with these concepts and over time you could total elite). I know from reading everything he's ever wrote, AND seeing all the DVD's, that's exactly where he's coming from. To put it in perspective, if Mark Rippetoe was to come on here and talk about Crossfit, the only thing he could say is that he's had one 600 lb deadlifter come out of there LOL. |
Good points, D, lol. That really does clear it up. And you got me with the Rippetoe thing, haha. I really was trying to say something similar...bascially that these tips aren't rules but I don't have your encyclopedic knowledge of WSB so please excuse if I sounded disrespectful.
Actually, though, it's a reason I don't like Supertraining..it's full of "assumptions, preconceptions, theories, and so on, without any practical direction. |
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