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Old 08-28-2007, 11:17 PM   #11
redcl123
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Ohh, forgot a question:
-why is it important for imtermediate trainees to take a coiuple of weeks of increasing the weights to their previous PR's? Don't you think only advance trainees should do it? I mean - this is the characteristic of the intermediate - he should be able to display increases in strength on a week to week basis...

Tell me what you all think
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Old 08-29-2007, 09:39 AM   #12
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^^^^It's not if you're talking about the "intensity" day. You've already sort of found out where you are at and you can use that to determine what you want to go for. You can bust out whatever you are capable of and there is no need to do intenstiy cycling there. At least not IMO.

The volume day (5x5) will of course need to be built up from a point below what one is capable of for that over at least a couple weeks or else you'll hit a wall very quickly.

Good deal on the chinups but I still think you should take out the Rows PR's on that day and JUST do the chinups. Doing maximums on rows is not something I would recommend and really it's pointless.

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If you act sanctimonious I will just list out your logical fallacies until you get pissed off and spew blasphemous remarks.
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Old 08-29-2007, 12:56 PM   #13
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Thanks...

So I'm taking rows out, so instead of:
-sunday: rows 5x5 across
-tuesday: DL 1x5
-thursday: pull-ups: 3 sets to failure

I get:
-sunday: chins-ups: 3 sets to failure
-tuesday: DL 1x5
-thursday: pull-ups: 3 sets to failure

I've added rows because I thought I should include rowing on the same plain of movement like the bench... but I geuss it doesn't really matter...

Thanks again, if it looks like I didn't understand something from you said, please correct me (english isn't my native languages, and I know many and they all mix in my head)...
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Old 08-29-2007, 01:06 PM   #14
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Oh, no no. Damn, I'm sorry. I didn't make myself clear. All I was saying was to drop the rows from the THURSDAY workout. In other words do the rows on Monday, 5x5 sets accross as usual but just do the pullups/chinups on Thursday after your squat and bench...sorry, I wasn't saying not to do rows at all! There is just no real use in setting row records and your energy would be better spent on that day bringing up the pullups/chins which are a very useful exercise in it's own right.

Now, if you want to do a couple of sets of pullups/chins on Tuesay also, after you rows that's cool too but I would just leave it like this:

Sunday: 5x5 Squat, Bench, Rows
Tuesday: DL, Press, light squat
Thursday: Squat, Bench RM attempt, pullups 3 sets to failure

And then later on if everything is going well you can add an accessory or two if you see fit. My fault entirely for the misunderstanding because I didn't make myself clear.

It definitely is a generally good idea to couple rows and bench in a similar plain of movement but don't worry about having the exact same amount of rowing and benching because deadlift actually counts somewhat in balancing that out. Also keep in mind that balancing bench with horzontal pulling (like rows) and balancing overhead pressing with vertical pulling (like pullups and pulldowns) is really only about the deltoid muscles themselves and is NO GUARANTEE in keeping the shoulder girdle healthy.

That is an oversimplistic thing that people have been selling. It's important but it's not everything unfortunately.

The way I've outlined is fine in terms of that kind of balance.
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Old 08-30-2007, 02:10 AM   #15
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Thanks for all the help Eric! I appreciate it alot, really

31\8\07 - Intensity:

Box squat:
bar x 5 x 2
40 x 5
60 x 3
70 x 2
80 x 5 x 1 (PR... felt ok, not too hard)

Bench:
bar x 5 x 2
35 x 5
48 x 3
63 x 2
73 x 4.5

(What's 4.5? I had the fifth, the bar was moving slowly but steady, but my partner, who is super concerned about good technique, saw my leg raising from the floor, so he stopped me in the middle of the 5'th rep... I explained to him that he should correct me later, on my next workout, and not stop me from doing a PR... anyway next week my legs will be on the floor, and I'll do a PR)

Pull ups to failure:
9, 9, 5 ---> total: 23, PR
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Old 08-30-2007, 07:34 AM   #16
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No problem.

Just to add to what I was saying about cycling back the "volume" day, just keep in mind that everyday is really "intensity" day the way this is setup. There ain't no high volume light weight bodybuilding stuff in here. The 5x5 day is only volume relative to the PR day. Not to mention you've got heavy deads in the middle. What you really have is just variations in intensity. So although those variations are starkly contrasted it is still "intense" by the strictest definition of the term, i.e. one relative to your 1RM. Anybody who has tried to progress by starting at an intensity close or at their maximal ability will tell you it's hard to progress from.
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Old 08-30-2007, 08:34 AM   #17
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Thanks for this response Eric, and for the PM you sent me.

Well, I understand that the optimal think right now will be continue progressing on "intensity" days, and start the "volume" days from 85% (of my RM5 max), then build it (every week) like this:

1. week 1 - 85%
2. week 2 - 92%
3. week 3 - 100%
and progress from here...

But... We know that lifting is both physiological as it is psychological... if I add my bench 5 kg, and my squat 7.5 kg, it'll just be good for my spirit, you know? I havn't seen a progress for a long time, and even though I know I should be smart and avoid my feelings and my desire for PR's 'at all costs', I just need these small PR's, like a 'breath of air' to stay in the game for a couple of months from now, you know? Hope you understand what I'm talking about, and don't think I'm such a stupid athelete, huh

Btw, I'm not excepting Rippetoe to give me 'cockie cutters', but surprisingly he doesn't say anything about gradually building the weights on volume days... He just said that when his 'novice routine' stops working, you should start something similar to this 'texas method'...

P.S - so when I'll get stuck, I won't try speed sets / 8X3 instead of 5x5, adding / take out sets, I'll just deload and steadily increase the volume like Eric says.
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Old 08-30-2007, 09:49 AM   #18
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actually, i did the texas method for over 16 weeks and i never had to really reset the weights ever.

u know how i did that? i didnt use percentages. i only used lbs.

SO, i hit my 5x5 max on week 6 - NOT week 4 like everyone else.

also, ur 5x5 max is NOT 85% of ur 5RM. ur 5RM and ur 5x5 are two totally different things. please find ur 5x5 max and scale back 30-35 lbs.

what do u mean by

Quote:
But... We know that lifting is both physiological as it is psychological... if I add my bench 5 kg, and my squat 7.5 kg, it'll just be good for my spirit, you know? I havn't seen a progress for a long time, and even though I know I should be smart and avoid my feelings and my desire for PR's 'at all costs', I just need these small PR's, like a 'breath of air' to stay in the game for a couple of months from now, you know? Hope you understand what I'm talking about, and don't think I'm such a stupid athelete, huh

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Old 08-30-2007, 10:14 AM   #19
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Ok, Maybe I wasn't clear about what I was saying... I was talking about delibvrately training bad (not building the volume gradually... 4-6 weeks - like you did), because I just wanted small PR's, so I can get my morale back and only then put my ego 'on the side' - deload and reload (building the volume 4 to 6 weeks, then go for PR's). Plus I have my excuses (that Rippetoe didn't write about it... ha-ha, lame I know)...

Anyway, it doesn't matter now. I've decided to follow your advice, so:

week 1:
5x5 across day - 85%
same for the "Press" in tuesdays

week 2:
5x5 across day - 90%
same for the "Press" in tuesdays

week 3:
5x5 across day - 95%
same for the "Press" in tuesdays

week 4:
5x5 across day - 100%
same for the "Press" in tuesdays

week 5 and so no - just break records!

"Intensity days" (all of the 1X5... thursdays) - I'm not cycling it, and I'll just try to break records during weeks 1-6, and of course from 6 and so no...

Ohh and sorry about confusing my 5x5 max and 1x5 max, just didn't notice it when I wrote it... I meant what you meant (problem solved ).

What do you say guys?
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Old 08-30-2007, 10:34 AM   #20
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why do u need small PRs to build morale. usually it works the other way around. im not sure but why dont u want to get confident in ur strength and THEN hit PRs instead of the other way around???
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