is creatine with milk ok ? - Page 2 - Bodybuilding Discussion on Bodybuilding.net Supplement Forum

Darkhorse · 07-26-2005, 10:57 AM

Hence all the companies scrambling to make a more efficient form of creatine:
-effervescent->fail
-creatine mono->Alot of sugar/carbs to work, cell-tech not withstanding...
-Krealklyn->higher ph (12 I think)
-CEE->balls deep IMO....Unfortunately still looking for studies to claim.
-Impact Nutrition's creatine (liquid claiming aloe vera protects creatine conversion to creatinine :eek:

-Trac Creatine liquid->Aaahhh!
-My personal favorite: Mass-Tech and other weightgainers stating they have a whole 2.2 grams of creatine per serving!!

What's next?...Injectibles?...Transdermals?...

Dr X · 07-26-2005, 11:02 AM

What's next?...Injectibles?...Transdermals?...[/quote]

I'm sure they will go there eventually :eek:

verbatimreturned · 07-27-2005, 09:14 AM

that would be crazy injecting creatine lol im sure someones working on it already

WantingMuscle7 · 07-28-2005, 04:26 AM

For the juices for me I dont always have grape juice or OJ so sometimes i pop grapes in my mouth then chew em get the juice tilt back head so juice doesnt come out then throw pill in then gulp it down same with oranges that doesnt make a dif from real juice to OJ does it?

verbatimreturned · 07-28-2005, 08:35 AM

well it really depends on what orange juice your using and for the grapes i think grape juice has more sugar in it, then just regular grapes

WantingMuscle7 · 07-29-2005, 07:51 PM

It was clementines (how ever u spell) for the oj i got out of em.

EricT · 07-30-2005, 05:55 PM

I definitely would not take creatine with milk. I doubt very much of it will ever make it's way into your muscles.

Other things affect absorption other than just the type of carbohydrate.
Assuming your'e not lactose intolerent and have plenty of lactase enzyme
then the lactose will be converted by lactase into galactose.

Galctose has a comparable rate of absorption to glucose. But dextrose/glucose in powder form doesn't need to be acted on by enzymes so it would stand to reason the pure gucose is the best, while fruits having more glucose than fructose come in second

Gastric emptying time should also be considered. Milk, with all it's proteins and fats, stays in the stomach longer. Creatine is not going to like the acid environment. Even in people with complete milk tolerance, milk can take hours to digest.

I can't prove it, but given that creatine is fairly expensive, I would think that taking it with milk would be a waste of money.

EricT · 07-30-2005, 05:55 PM

Double posted, sorry.

Darkhorse · 07-30-2005, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by verbatimreturned

well it really depends on what orange juice your using and for the grapes i think grape juice has more sugar in it, then just regular grapes

Remember that orange juice is very acidic compared to most other things.

Recent studies (I'm looking) and reports show that using Creatine with orange juice and other citric juices might destroy the potency of Creatine and may cause stomach upset in some individuals. Poor results are normally caused by this. We recommend mixing your Creatine with either water or grape juice ( not grapefruit juice which is also citric ), this will provide the best effects.

EricT · 07-30-2005, 07:19 PM

311, I'm with you on the juice thing. Especially given the high osmality of a pure dextrose solution. I think the dextrose/maltodextrin solves this problem and works very well, while also addressing the problem of a premature insuling spike.

But they both come down to pure glucose in the bloodstream and it's hard to know how much is enough. Fruit juice is easier to manage in this respect.

Still, just plain dextrose will produce results. Even if it gives you the runs.

I personally don't use any sugar in my creatine formula. I get what seems to be very quick absorption seeing that my muscles blow up to an almost painful extent somewhere around 20-30 minutes later. I can't "prove there's creatine in them, but there's definitely water, so you do the math.

You guys are probably going to say that there's no real scientific evidence to support it (although I've seen some stuff) and that I am full of crap. It may not work for everbody but it seems to be working for me.

Glutamine + Creatine in a 2:1 ratio. Two hundred or more miligrams Alpha Lipoic Acid. Lots of water.

ALA + acid I know. But creatine, according to my research, has been shown to be fairly stable in weak acids. (the acids in orange juice would be worse) and this mixture would leave the stomach fairly quickly.

I know a lot of people are down on glutamine. It's not very bioavailable, so on, and so forth. I think it works in this combination, even without the ALA (which seems to work better).

Most of the proteins we eat have bad bioavailibility, after all.

07-26-2005, 10:57 AM	#11 (permalink)
Darkhorse Moderator Rank: Light Heavyweight Experience: 7-10 Years Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: CA Posts: 4,120 Country: Gender:	Hence all the companies scrambling to make a more efficient form of creatine: -effervescent->fail -creatine mono->Alot of sugar/carbs to work, cell-tech not withstanding... -Krealklyn->higher ph (12 I think) -CEE->balls deep IMO....Unfortunately still looking for studies to claim. -Impact Nutrition's creatine (liquid claiming aloe vera protects creatine conversion to creatinine :eek: -Trac Creatine liquid->Aaahhh! -My personal favorite: Mass-Tech and other weightgainers stating they have a whole 2.2 grams of creatine per serving!! What's next?...Injectibles?...Transdermals?...
	Darkhorse's Sig:My Training Philosophy how big would you be if ALL you did was: Squat 400 x 20 Deadlift 500 x 5 Bench 315 x 5, or dip with 100 lbs added. Chin with 75 lbs strapped to your waist x 5 Miltary Press 225 x 8 Pretty ****ing big is my guess. Without any "rear delt work". IA

07-26-2005, 11:02 AM	#12 (permalink)
Dr X Rank: Lightweight Experience: 10+ Years Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: in the deep recesses of your mind Posts: 1,052 Country: Gender:	What's next?...Injectibles?...Transdermals?...[/quote] I'm sure they will go there eventually :eek:
	Dr X's Sig:The Fool say in his heart "There is no God"

07-30-2005, 05:55 PM	#18 (permalink)
EricT Moderator Rank: Heavyweight Experience: 7-10 Years Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,892 Country: Gender:	Double posted, sorry. Last edited by EricT; 07-30-2005 at 06:43 PM.

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07-27-2005, 09:14 AM	#13 (permalink)
verbatimreturned Rank: Lightweight Experience: 2-3 Years Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: new york Posts: 1,376 Country: Gender:	that would be crazy injecting creatine lol im sure someones working on it already

07-28-2005, 04:26 AM	#14 (permalink)
WantingMuscle7 Rank: Bantamweight Experience: 1-2 Years Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: PA Posts: 687 Country:	For the juices for me I dont always have grape juice or OJ so sometimes i pop grapes in my mouth then chew em get the juice tilt back head so juice doesnt come out then throw pill in then gulp it down same with oranges that doesnt make a dif from real juice to OJ does it?

07-28-2005, 08:35 AM	#15 (permalink)
verbatimreturned Rank: Lightweight Experience: 2-3 Years Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: new york Posts: 1,376 Country: Gender:	well it really depends on what orange juice your using and for the grapes i think grape juice has more sugar in it, then just regular grapes

07-29-2005, 07:51 PM	#16 (permalink)
WantingMuscle7 Rank: Bantamweight Experience: 1-2 Years Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: PA Posts: 687 Country:	It was clementines (how ever u spell) for the oj i got out of em.

07-30-2005, 05:55 PM	#17 (permalink)
EricT Moderator Rank: Heavyweight Experience: 7-10 Years Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,892 Country: Gender:	I definitely would not take creatine with milk. I doubt very much of it will ever make it's way into your muscles. Other things affect absorption other than just the type of carbohydrate. Assuming your'e not lactose intolerent and have plenty of lactase enzyme then the lactose will be converted by lactase into galactose. Galctose has a comparable rate of absorption to glucose. But dextrose/glucose in powder form doesn't need to be acted on by enzymes so it would stand to reason the pure gucose is the best, while fruits having more glucose than fructose come in second Gastric emptying time should also be considered. Milk, with all it's proteins and fats, stays in the stomach longer. Creatine is not going to like the acid environment. Even in people with complete milk tolerance, milk can take hours to digest. I can't prove it, but given that creatine is fairly expensive, I would think that taking it with milk would be a waste of money.

07-30-2005, 07:19 PM	#20 (permalink)
EricT Moderator Rank: Heavyweight Experience: 7-10 Years Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 5,892 Country: Gender:	311, I'm with you on the juice thing. Especially given the high osmality of a pure dextrose solution. I think the dextrose/maltodextrin solves this problem and works very well, while also addressing the problem of a premature insuling spike. But they both come down to pure glucose in the bloodstream and it's hard to know how much is enough. Fruit juice is easier to manage in this respect. Still, just plain dextrose will produce results. Even if it gives you the runs. I personally don't use any sugar in my creatine formula. I get what seems to be very quick absorption seeing that my muscles blow up to an almost painful extent somewhere around 20-30 minutes later. I can't "prove there's creatine in them, but there's definitely water, so you do the math. You guys are probably going to say that there's no real scientific evidence to support it (although I've seen some stuff) and that I am full of crap. It may not work for everbody but it seems to be working for me. Glutamine + Creatine in a 2:1 ratio. Two hundred or more miligrams Alpha Lipoic Acid. Lots of water. ALA + acid I know. But creatine, according to my research, has been shown to be fairly stable in weak acids. (the acids in orange juice would be worse) and this mixture would leave the stomach fairly quickly. I know a lot of people are down on glutamine. It's not very bioavailable, so on, and so forth. I think it works in this combination, even without the ALA (which seems to work better). Most of the proteins we eat have bad bioavailibility, after all.

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