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Duel Factor Theory

Training discussion on Duel Factor Theory, within the Bodybuilding Forum; I've planned my next cycle utilizing duel factor theory after I finish with what I'm doing now. It's basically 4 ...


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Old 07-24-2005, 01:48 PM   #1
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I've planned my next cycle utilizing duel factor theory after I finish with what I'm doing now. It's basically 4 weeks of planned loading (slightly overtraining) followed by 1-2 weeks of deloading (lower volume/frequency=recovery). It's alot more complex than that, but I'll be headed back and forth. Anyone ever try this? I think it's definately a much better theory than the one muscle per week way of life IMO. I just figured I'd put something new out here instead of the usual....Here's a good writeup by Madcow1-

Quote:
"As for recovery - do you really think muscles recover in a few days? Maybe a week right? Nope, look up complete tissue remodelming, it can take well over a month from a single bout of weight training if I remember correctly but regardless it is far longer than any split in use. Bottom line you are almost always training in some type of recovery deficit.

Where did the 1x per week come from? It came about because BBers started talking about overtraining back in the late 1980's (at the time just previous to this the common workout in the muscle mags was 3 on 1 off and I remember a fair amount of AM/PM days too). A few guys began to notice that if they took time off they came back stronger. They then thought that this was because their workouts weren't optimally spaced and timed. This is the essense of single factor theory or Supercompensation where you go in the gym and work ultra hard pushing your muscles to the point of full exertion (welcome to the training to failure school). Then you retreat quietly and heal up slightly stronger. Just after you've gotten your growth response but before you begin to detrain and lose it you hit that muscle again and do the same thing. The idea is that you can link up a series of these and grow in a linear pattern.

Pretty fucking cool eh? Too bad it's wrong. First, there's no scientific backing. Arthur Jones is partially responsible for this shit and he's long since recanted his short, intense, and infrequent methodology a la Mentzer's Heavy Duty ;) . I will say that this program does work for beginners but for an experienced lifter it is drastically suboptimal. Oh yeah - if you take a shitty stimulus and magnify the response with enough drugs you can still make progress but for a given individual a supperior stimulus would allow for more gains at an individual's given dosage or equal gains for that person at a lower dosage level.

So where does that leave us? Well luckily people figured this stuff out a couple decades ago. There's a fatigue factor that gets built into this stuff and managing this fatique is important (both CNS and at the muscular level). You see, you can make gains and train without being fully recovered, it's actually better (think back to the people taking some time off and noticing they came back stronger - we'll revisit this in a moment). Rather than thinking about a single workout as a stimulus, consider a block of training - let's say 2-4 weeks. The fatigue is actually a recovery deficit that accrues during stimulative training. Unfortunately, a deficit means that it can't continue forever because you are running your body into the ground - but wait! This is actually fortunate.

You see, the idea that an experienced lifter can go into the gym and train once and then have his body respond with increased musculature on a consistent basis is rediculous. The body is first and foremost a survival machine. Muscle is calorically expensive and it's the last thing the body wants to add (people who had this genetic makeup died in famines very quickly and aren't around to reproduce). So a single session for an experienced lifter won't convince the body to pack on more muscle, and definitely not a short and infrequent stimulus because the body isn't convinced there is need. Bring in the fatigue accrual - in a training block of coninuously increasing fatigue the body gets a different message. The message is that there is a frequent, sustained, and increasing need for adaptation and that the body is falling behind and will soon break down under the strain. This is the stimulus we are looking for.

So now you train hard for 4 weeks and build up this deficit where you are right on the verge of overtraining (this point is called overreaching and the 4 weeks are called loading). The body knows it's screwed. What do you do? Pull the rug out and allow it to recover (deload). Generally you slash volume and frequency for a period to allow the body to recover and add some muscle in adaptation to the training stress. After a period of deloading you come back and load again - bigger and stronger (wait - remember about the BBers who took some time off and came back stronger - amazing fit is it not?).

This whole idea is called dual factor theory. Now most BBers haven't heard of it and couldn't explain it. It's largely greek to most of the people reading this. I mean, there are guys on here that know just about everything about drugs and diet but this is brand new to them. Well, it isn't brand new. It's not even remotely new or a little bit obscure. This is how 99.9% of the world's elite athletes are trained. We are talking near universal acceptance by every researcher and strength coach in the US, China, Europe, the Eastern Block, the former Soviet nations - everywhere. It's absolutely and totally prolific. On top of that there is a massive mound of scientific evidence to support it.

So how do you incorporate something like this? Logical question because in all my time at EF <I was here for a while as Madcow1 in 2000-2002ish too> I see people posting their programs and splits but there are critical factors missing. I can take the best split and exercise selection and bust my ass in the gym yet the stimulus is subpar because I'm not providing for loading/deloading. Generally this is handled by managing volume. A high volume period and then a low volume period.

There is a good program here that breaks many of the common rules in this thread (number of sets, frequency of training, all kinds of stuff). It has you squat 3x per week in addition to DLing once, rowing and benching twice. That won't work you say, no one can squat 3x per week. Well it's actually not a problem and people have been running this program for 30 years and making huge gains. Several board members here are running it now or have just finished with big steroid like results but they were natural lifters (off the top of my head one is up 17lbs in week 7, another 16lbs in week 6, one younger guy was up 12 in week 6-7 but got that damn flu and has been out of commission). I didn't make this program so I can't take credit but it was orignally designed by Bill Starr, one of the greatest strength coaches ever, and later adapted by a Johnsmith182 from Meso who is actually one of the US' finest strength coaches - incidentally this job entails adding LBM to athletes in time constrained environments and this program is as good as any designed at doing it and far far better than just about anything most guys are using around here to add muscle. It's also avoided like the plague by weightclass constrained athletes who are near the top of their class as it simply causes too much weight gain and the diet restriction to prevent it is very severe. I ended up running it a few years ago and had to slash my calories twice in order to keep my gains down to the 8-10lbs range over 8 weeks (and I was not stuffing myself before). The cream of the program is that it is fantastic at adding LBM to an athlete but is also a very simple and easy to understand implementation of dual factor theory.

So anyway - that's the jist on training. None of this is revolutionary. It is in fact very standard stuff. The single factor camp is nearly empty devoid of anyone except BBers and I can certainly respect an educated choice to disagree in the face of all this but the fact that almost no one understands or has heard of what is the basic and dominant theory of training around the world doesn't exactly give me confidence that this is the situation. In fact the situation is that BBing has fallen so far behind on training knowledge that something really needs to be done."

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Old 07-25-2005, 07:32 AM   #2
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sounds pretty solid 0311, its funny the begining of the article reminds me of how most people train ... if its not working, just do it harder, longer, or more times. its like saying, well my brakes on my car dont work, maybe if i push on the peddal harder they will ...


also, from that breif explination, this sounds a little like hst unless i read it wrong.

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Old 07-25-2005, 07:39 AM   #3
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HST is nothing more than linear periodization. It utilizes duel factor by the use of an 8 day lay-off (stratigic deconditioning). The way I'm doing it is instead of taking that week off and decondition my muscles for the use of lighter weights (HST), I'm dropping the freq. and volume but keeping the weight and intensity high. So in essence, I will still increase strength during my recovery block. I like this way better than to take a week off because I still won't have real serious DOMS when my next phase begins.
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Old 07-25-2005, 07:42 AM   #4
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yeah i was a little concerned with taking that week off at the begining, and the week before that to find my max's an shit. But it just so happens to work out great, i have a weeks vacation coming up, so that will work out perfect this time around.

I may need to switch it up in the future though.
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Old 07-27-2005, 08:22 AM   #5
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Anyone try utilizing dual factor, or are ya'll singer factor dependant?
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Old 07-27-2005, 08:28 AM   #6
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will you post your schedual for this. i'd like to see how it looks ... I'm a visual learner
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Old 07-27-2005, 08:35 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrdgain81
will you post your schedual for this. i'd like to see how it looks ... I'm a visual learner
It'll take me a few minutes so hold on...
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Old 07-27-2005, 08:56 AM   #8
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Sure, it's actually many moons worth. There are many different things you could do. It's basically a loading phase (3-4,5,6, whatever weeks) followed by a deload phase (1-2 weeks) During a deload you don't stop training like HST does. You still train with high intensity and weight, but very low volume and frequency so your body can catch back up....

The program that I'm looking at is a combo of Madcow's tweek of Bill Star's 5x5 coupled with a 2-3 week DFHT phase. I do this because 5x5 is an awesome strength program with a good amount of hypertrophy. DFHT is solely a hypertrophy program with strength gains being minimal. So it makes sense to start with the strength/size of 5x5, then keep the strength gains I made and apply them for hypertrophy purposes only. Follow me?

Basically here's what I got:

5x5 format:
4 weeks (loading)
1 week (deload)
3 weeks (intensity)
1 week (deload)
DFHT format:
2 weeks (loading)
1 week (deload)
ect.........

Here's the specifics:
5x5 Volume Phase (which is loading)
-4 weeks hitting records in week 4.

Monday:
Olympic Squats: 5x5
Benching: 5x5 (flat)
JS Rows: 5x5
Accessory (triceps)

Wednesday:
Olympic Squats: 5x5 (reduced 20% from Monday) or Front Squats 5x5
Standing Military Press: 5x5
Deadlifts: 5x5
Pull ups: 5x5
Accessory (biceps)

Friday:
Olympic Squats: 5x5 (1x5 pyramid up in weight)
Benching: 5x5 (incline or flat)
JS Rows: 5x5
Accessory (triceps)

3x3 Deload-1 week; 3 sets of 3 reps; using same weight as last week and dropping frequency to only twice this week:

Monday:
Olympic Squats: 3x3
Bench: 3x3
Rows: 3x3

Thursday:
Light Olympic Squats (70% of Monday): 3x3
Deadlifts: 3x3
Military Press: 3x3
Chins: 3x3

3 Week Intensity Phase
-Week 2 is 3x3 records.
-Week 3 is 1x3 records.

Monday:
Olympic Squats: 3x3
Benching: 3x3 (flat)
JS Rows: 3x3
Accessory (triceps)

Wednesday:
Standing Military Press: 3x3
Deadlifts: 3x3
Pull ups: 3x3
Accessory (biceps)

Friday:
Olympic Squats: 3x3 (working up each set)
Benching: 3x3 (incline or flat)
JS Rows: 3x3
Accessory (triceps)

Another [U]1 week Deload:[/U]
-Same format as other deload.

Cont....

Last edited by Darkhorse; 07-27-2005 at 09:00 AM.. Reason: dressing it up
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Old 07-27-2005, 09:11 AM   #9
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Dual Factor Hypertrophy Training (DFHT)
2-3 weeks

Monday: Upper Body
1./// Barbell Bench Press: 4x10
2./// Incline Dumbell Press: 3x8-12
3./// JS Rows: 5x5
4./// Barbell Shrugs: 3x8-10
5./// Side Laterals: 3x8
6./// Skullcrushers: 3x10-12
7./// Incline Dumbbell: 2 x 8
8./// Hammer Curls: 2 x 8-10

Tuesday: Lower Body
1./// Olympic Squats: 5x5 (working up to a 5 rm)
2./// Goodmornings: 3x5
3./// Pullthroughs: 3-4x10-12
4./// Hamstring Curls: 2x10-12
5./// Leg Extensions: 2x 10-12
6./// Weighted Abs/ Obliques: 5x10
7./// Calves: DC Style

Thursday: Upper Body
1./// Flat Barbell Bench Press: 5x5 or 4x3 (heavy)
2./// Board Press: 5 rep max (smythe)
3./// Standing Military: 5x5 or 4x10
4./// Dips: 3x8-10
5./// Pullups: 5xfailure
6./// Reverse Grip Pushdowns: 3x10-12
7./// Barbell Curls: 2-3x8

Friday: Lower Body
1./// Olympic Squats: 3x5, 1x10 (lighter)
2./// Rack Deadlifts: 3x5-8
3./// Pullthroughs: (3-5 sets of 10-12, some arched back, some rounded back)
4./// Hamstring Curls: 2x10
5./// Leg Extentions: 2x10
6./// Weighted Hyperextensions: 2x10-12
7./// Weighted Abs/ Obliques: 5x10
8./// Calves: DC Style

* This program will kick my irish ass for sure, but that's the point. If everyone looks at this and thinks overtraining then it's a good thing, because that's my goal->slightly overreaching within 2 weeks (no more than 3)

1-2 Weeks DFHT Deload

Monday: Upper Body
1./// Barbell Bench Press: 4x10
2./// Incline Dumbell Press: 3x8-12
3./// JS Rows: 5x5

Tuesday: Lower Body
1./// Olympic Squats: 5x5 (working up to a 5 rm)
2./// Goodmornings: 3x5

Thursday: Upper Body
1./// Flat Barbell Bench Press: 5x5 or 4x3 (heavy)
2./// Board Press: 5 rep max (smythe)
3./// Standing Military: 5x5 or 4x10

Friday: Lower Body
1./// Front Squats: 3x5, 1x10 (lighter)
2./// Rack Deadlifts: 3x5-8

*As you can see, the deload will be a walk in the park for 1-2 weeks, recovering from the previous block.

That's it. Should be fun. DFT makes ALOT of sense to me. I like to train balls to the wall for a few weeks until I almost die, then back off drastically and recover (while staying heavy). If anyone wants the DFHT format to pick exercises/reps on, just ask and ye shall receive. ;)
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Old 07-27-2005, 09:32 AM   #10
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One more thing to boot. DC Training and HST are both duel factor IMO and they are two of the best programs out there when it comes to results. DC uses a blast period moving up in weights until you can't make any more progress (slightly overreaching) followed by a cruise which is nothing more than taking it easy lifting, lowering the weights, and using straight sets instead of RP's. HST is a linear periodization program that doesn't use fatigue, but uses the same type of blocks. 6-8 weeks of progression and at the last week you'll be using your heaviest weights. Once you're done you SD for at least a week (recovery block).
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