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Is this possible without drugs?

Training discussion on Is this possible without drugs?, within the Bodybuilding Forum; I was browsing the net and came across this page : http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/charlie1.htm Is this seriously possible in 12 weeks of ...


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Old 06-29-2007, 08:32 PM   #1
Guzak
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Red face Is this possible without drugs?

I was browsing the net and came across this page : http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/charlie1.htm
Is this seriously possible in 12 weeks of just hard work?
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Old 06-30-2007, 08:40 AM   #2
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I'm gonna go ahead and say he had some 'help'.
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Old 06-30-2007, 09:17 AM   #3
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I think you can pull off the tan.
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Old 07-01-2007, 08:43 AM   #4
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i suppose its possible but not very probable unless he was regaining previous muscle. they never mention that in those before and after type ads. they also never mention if the person is a rank beginner or has been training for years.
if he flared his lats and sucked in his abs in the first pic (like he did in all the other pics) he would not look nearly as bloated and small.

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Old 07-01-2007, 08:46 AM   #5
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I bet he photoshopped a few things!
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Old 07-06-2007, 09:37 AM   #6
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If you look at his before picture you can see he was already a pretty big guy. The shorts tell me he probably used to play football or something like that.

Twelve weeks to put on a few lbs of muscle, loose 20 lbs of fat, shave and get a nice tan. Sure, it is not like he went from the 95lb weakling.
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Old 07-06-2007, 09:42 AM   #7
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I can see a little of what you're saying. If it had listed beginning weight and bodyfat vs. ending weight and bodyfat that would be more telling, though. Hell, lighting, camera angle, being greased up and tanned can make a big difference. But just looking at the overall body look ate the beginning and end it honestly to me looks like more than a few pounds of meat.

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If you act sanctimonious I will just list out your logical fallacies until you get pissed off and spew blasphemous remarks.
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Old 07-06-2007, 09:59 AM   #8
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A lot of bodybuilding is an optical illusion. It is more about the appearance of size rather than the actual size.

In that first pic he was probably about 20-25% bodyfat and the after he was probably under 10%. That makes a huge difference in how big you LOOK.

A great example of this illusion is Frank Zane. He competed at about 175-180lb. He was the lightest Mr. O ever. Even though I outweigh him by 20 lbs, he looks a hell of a lot bigger.

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Old 07-06-2007, 10:57 AM   #9
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^^^^I certainly agree with all that. But that guy in the last photo is ready to enter a natural contest. Optical illusion I doubt Frank Zane every looked anything like that first photo before he dieted down. But anyway it's the time frame that's in question. And I just don't see to many people with normal genetics and natural achieving that kind of thing. He would have had to bulk up some not matter what you think. And then he would have had to diet down really quick to a very low bf without losing much of that. I can see the cutting but I don't see the time being enough do both. But if people want to believe this is easy and you can go from dumpy to extraordinary in 12 weeks more power to you.

Personally I'm with Kane. He may not have had help but it looks like it. Either that or he is "talented" genetically for bbing.

I've got friends who don't look too much different than photo one, and there is no way I would tell them they'd get something like the after shot in 12 weeks.

Last edited by EricT; 07-06-2007 at 11:33 AM..
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