In terms of pre for shakes we are talking about immeditately pre...say 15 minutes..otherwise for an hour before you want some slower digesting stuff. Both would be good.
I'm going by the studies, hrdgain. Not personal opinion. Just because the guys that wrote the bulking sticky say they believe it's the most important doesn't mean too much to me. There has been more research done on the subject since that was written anyway. We have a whole sticky on this info, rather than the little bit of info in the how to bulk sticky. I invite people to read that info and come to their own conclusions. The stuff you take in immediately pre will be there just when you need it post PLUS delivering carbs as you work. That way there is no waiting around for the post to take effect. Although I'm definitely not saying I think post is unimportant!
I agree if you are not doing fast carbs and protein immediately pre then post becomes more important. Otherwise the fast stuff immediately pre will be do more for you. But of course I think you should do both. I don't mind splitting hairs a little bit
Some people do up to 30 grams for pre and post...and maybe more for post. I don't think you need more than 15 to 20 grams for pre. Having too much protein is going to be detrimental to the fast delivery.
If you start with a basic mix of 15 to 20 grams of protein and 30 to 40 grams of carbs for both pre and post that should be a perfect way to start. Plenty of water.