point taken eric3237 thanks :-) i have spent the last 2 weeks in the gym using practically no weight on the bar learning form for a range of excercises mainly, squats, bench press, deadlift, chin, bent over rows etc. i have seen so many of my mates injuried in teh gym from throwing the weights up and down rather than actually lifting them. i am quite happy not to be lifting the massive weights as long as im working at 100% of my effort whilst keeping form then in my eyes ill be training as hard as the guys pushing 3 - 4 times my weight. im trying my best to get all parts of training spot on as far as i can thats why im trying to find a good training program for mass rather than go in the gym doing nothing but dumbell curls :-)