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kimm4 · #51 09-02-2008, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dougz

Ok, just now seeing the error of my ways..

I'm basically starting from zero, here, so all this info is making my head hurt..

What I've learned from the stickies so far, correct me where I'm wrong:

* I've been eating WAY less than I should, and eating more meals per day..

* I need to be eating some cod liver oil and glutamine every day

* I need to work out my body parts more frequently (currently I work out 2 body parts, every other day - back and chest one day, legs the next, etc).

* I should look into creatine, and pre/post work-out meals.

* I need to incorporate squats and deadlifts into my routine.

* I need to run on my days off, not right before I lift (I had been running 2 miles, then lifting).

Here's some questions that I need the hand holding on (like I say, I'm sure I could find them, but I'm starting to get burned out, taking all this in, and could use some cut and dry info:

What are some good recipes for pre-work-out meals?

What are some good recipes for post work-out meals?

What's a good pre-morning run meal?

Can the rest of my meals be 40-30-30 balanced?

From the formula I got here, it says for moderate activity, I should be eating 3175 calories a day. Is that to gain weight, or maintain the same weight while losing body fat?

At this point my head is on a swivel and I'm wondering if I should just get a trainer and get him/her to tell me what to do and when to do it, so any tips, feedbacks, sample work-out routines, and recipes you could share would be really appreciated!!!

Based on your stats you need around 2657 calories to drop bodyfat. If you're looking to try to add some lean muscle in the process maybe try a macro breakdown of 50p/25c/25f...might work better for you.

dougz · #52 09-03-2008, 05:05 AM

Ok, thanks Kim!

I'll start keeping track of how much I'm actually eating per day, and see what happens when I add/subtract, eat 50/25/25..

Is it easier to get the body fat down, then try to bulk up, or bulk up and then try to cut?

Ross86 · #53 09-03-2008, 07:04 AM

If you have less muscle mass, then you will lose less muscle mass during a cut....all other things held equal. I think it's better to go ahead and get your BF% under control and then lean bulk to a desirable weight. You can do it without putting on loads of fat. So when you go to cut after that bulk, you won't have loads of fat to get rid of...it will be a lot easier.

Andrew.cook · #54 09-03-2008, 07:21 AM

That a personal oppinion or is there some research to back that up, Ross?

Ross86 · #55 09-03-2008, 07:44 AM

Let me re-phrase:

If you have less muscle mass, then you will have more potential to lose less muscle during a cut (that statement is the definition of verbose). It also depends on what BF% you're dieting to.

You're right Andrew, if you and I were to cut slowly, then there is no reason why either of us shouldn't be able to maintain the same amount of muscle mass to a certain point.

& the rest of that post was opinion.

kimm4 · #56 09-03-2008, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dougz

Ok, thanks Kim!

I'll start keeping track of how much I'm actually eating per day, and see what happens when I add/subtract, eat 50/25/25..

Is it easier to get the body fat down, then try to bulk up, or bulk up and then try to cut?

If a person has a solid base to work with why bulk when you still have bodyfat to lose? Why add more fat to the fat you already have? Most of the time when a person bulks they end up adding more fat and hardly any muscle...I see it happen all the time and it makes absolutely no sense to me. Then when they go to cut, they have bust their asses even harder to lose more fat. People need to understand that you can add muscle and be lean at the same time...it takes tons of hard work but it can be done.

I've always looked at it this way:

bulking - en excuse to get fat.
clean bulk - people in denial.

Once you get to the bodyfat that you desire than it's best to slowly start adding calories back into your plan. The idea is to keep lean but continue working on adding muscle to your frame...you need to play around with numbers and find what works best for you.

I've always told my clients to eat clean and lift your ass off...the results will come...but patience is the key because it's a long road.

Ross86 · #57 09-03-2008, 09:33 AM

Quote:

I've always looked at it this way:

bulking - en excuse to get fat.
clean bulk - people in denial.

I like that; that's pretty good.

In most cases, it's very true.

Andrew.cook · #58 09-03-2008, 09:39 AM

Kim, I have NEVER needed a reason to get fat

Regardless, I do think that you need to break a few eggs to make an egg based food. By that, I mean that I don't know that you can put on muscle without putting on a little fat. Just like I'm not sure you can lose fat without losing a little muscle in the process.

Either way, I'm not fat, or ripped... I'm just right. Only bodybuilders need to worry about bulking or cutting.

kimm4 · #59 09-03-2008, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew.cook

Kim, I have NEVER needed a reason to get fat

Regardless, I do think that you need to break a few eggs to make an egg based food. By that, I mean that I don't know that you can put on muscle without putting on a little fat. Just like I'm not sure you can lose fat without losing a little muscle in the process.

Either way, I'm not fat, or ripped... I'm just right. Only bodybuilders need to worry about bulking or cutting.

Andrew, if that's you in your avi you've done a great job!

Bulking and cutting is kind of old school. Most bb's (and I'm talking natural) do stay lean in the off season. Don't get me wrong they don't keep their stage look and they add a little fat to their frames...but not tons. If you cut the right way you can lose fat without losing muscle in the process. The idea is to do long slow dieting, throw in some refeeds, don't kill yourself with cardio...blah, blah, blah.

Andrew.cook · #60 09-03-2008, 10:13 AM

It is me in the Avatar. I'm not a bodybuilder though, and what you see is what you get. I used to watch my diet very closely, but these days I mostly keep it clean (because that is what I like) but I'm not afraid to throw down with a pizza or some dogs on the grill. I'm concerned with body weight, as I compete and that is the measure of whether I get my butt kicked as the lightest guy in a heavier weight class or the heaviest guy in a lighter class. So I eat what I eat and I tend to stay pretty steady at around 200lbs. I don't give it much thought.

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Can someone hold my hand for this first little bit??